Ott's Fundamentals (Ep.02) - 1.1.1 to 1.1.7

Author Streamed Thursday September 23rd, 2021

There are 18 episodes in the Live:Fundamentals series.

Streamed September 23rd, 2021

Ott's Fundamentals (Ep.02) - 1.1.1 to 1.1.7

Streamed September 19th, 2021

Ott's Fundamentals (Ep.01) - Introduction

From:Book 1, Part 1, Item 1to:Book 1, Part 1, Item 7of:Fundamentals of Catholic Dogmaby:Dr. Ludwig Ott


Ott's Fundamentals (Ep.02) - 1.1.1 to 1.1.7

Author Streamed September 12th, 2021

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okay i am live i'm gonna just pick up where i reading from the big thoughts fundamentals of catholic dogma we're going to do we're going to start book one the unity part one the unity of god his section one the existence of god chapter one the natural no ability of the existence of god section one the possibility of the natural knowledge of god in the light of god our creator and lord can be known with certainty by the natural light of reason from created things this is a de fide dogma the highest form of dogma if you want to see what the different forms of dogma are the different grades of certainty of the dogmas go back and listen to or watch the prior episode which was the introduction that's going to talk tell you all about that different grades of certainty among the dogmas a day dogma is the highest grade of certainty among other dogmas continuing with the text the vatican council defined then it says in latin you can translate that for yourself i'll read the english if any if anybody says that the one true god our creator and lord cannot be known with certainty in the light of human reason by those things which have been made anathema sit let him be accursed or the vatican definition stresses the following points number two the object of our knowing is the one true god our creator and lord therefore an extra mundane i wonder if uh this two i just read two i wonder if it was supposed to read a that might be a mistake a i'll assume that it was a because the following ones are b c d and e so i'll start again a the object of our knowing is the one true god our creator and lord therefore an extra mundane extra mundane i guess means supernatural above the ordinary b the subjective principle of knowledge is natural reason in the condition of see the means of knowledge are created d the knowledge is from its nature and e such knowledge of god is possible but it is not the only way of knowing not everyone is going to come to god number two scriptural proof according to the testimony of holy writ the existence of god can be known a from nature quote for by the greatness of the beauty and of the creature the creator of them seen and then another citation from romans 1 20 quote for the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen being understood by the things that are made his eternal power and his divinity also so that they are inexcusable end quote the knowledge of god witnessed to in those two passages is a natural certain immediate and easily achieved be from conscience see romans 2 14 and following quote when for when the gentiles for when the gentiles who know not the mosaic law do by nature these things that are of the law these having not the law are allah to themselves who shew the work of the law written in end quote i'll read that again for when the gentiles who know not the law do by nature these things that are of the law these having not the law are a law to themselves who show the work of the law written in their hearts end quote the heathens that is the he's the heathens that is no naturally without supernatural revelation the essential content of the in their hearts a law has been written whose binding power indicates a supreme c from history see acts 14 14-16 and 17 26-29 saint paul in his discourses at lystra and at the ariel gapus in athens shows that god reveals himself in beneficial works beneficent works also to the heathens and that it is easy to find him as he is near to each of us quote for in him we live and move and three proof from tradition the fathers in referring to the assertions of holy scripture stressed the possibility of the facility of the natural knowledge of god compared to tullian quote oh testimony of the soul which is by its nature christian end quote the greek fathers preferred the cosmological proofs of god which proceed from external experience the latin fathers preferred the psychological proofs which flow from inner experience compare theophilus of antioch quote god has called everything into existence from nothing so that his greatness might be known and understood through his works just as the soul in man is not seen as it is invisible but is known through the movement of the body so god cannot be seen with human eyes but he is observed and known through providence and his works just as one at the site of a well-equipped ship which sweeps over the sea and steers toward a harbor becomes aware that there is a helmsman on her who directs her so also one must be aware that god is the director of everything even though he is not seen with bodily eyes as he cannot be apprehended by them end quote compare saint irenaeus saint john chrysostom give the citations there if you want to number four the innate idea of god taking their stand on the authority of the father's many catholic theologians for example ludwig thomas tomasinus heinrich clee anton shtowden meyer johannes von kun taught that the idea of god is not acquired by deductive thinking from the world of experience but is innate in man idea certainly many of the fathers for example saint justin saint justin martyr that is and saint clement of alexandria characterized the knowledge of god as automatic not learned not learned i should say automatically learned implanted self-taught or as saint john of damascus says quote the knowledge of the existence of god is implanted by him in all in their nature end quote but as the same fathers teach that we must win the knowledge of god from the contemplation of nature therefore according to their conception what is innate is not the idea of god as such but the ability easily and to a certain extent spontaneously to know the existence of god from his works compare saint thomas in boethium de trinitate there's the latin and the englishes the knowledge of him is said to be innate in us in so far as we can easily know the existence of god by means of principles which are innate in us so the knowledge of him is said to be innate in us insofar as we can easily know the existence of god by means of interesting section two the possibility of a proof of god's existence and here we have another dogma the existence of god can be proved by means cent fide proxima that's the grade of certitude of this dogma you can go back and verify all the different grades in my continuing with the text now the traditionalists l e botan and a botany bonetti having been reproved by the teaching authority of the church signed the assertion that reason can with certainty prove the existence of god both of those men i'm reading i'm just commentating here in parenthesis it shows the deaths of both of those men that were in the late 19th century 1869 for botan 1879 for bonnete just have some historical continuing now with the text pope pius x extended the vatican definition of the of the natural nobility of god in the anti-modernist oath 1910 by the more exact statement that the existence of god can formally be proved through reason by means of the principle of causality the latin is given you can translate that if you like god the beginning and end of all things can be known with certainty by the natural light of reason as a c as a cause is known by its effects from those things that are made that is by the visible works of creation and can be equal and can equally be the possibility of the proof of god flows a from the dogma of the natural nobility of god for the proof of god's existence is distinguished from the elementary knowledge of god only in that the basis for the knowledge is proposed in a more scientific form be from the fact that since the time of the father's theologians have reduced proofs of the existence of god see for example aristides minutius felix saint augustine st john of damascus all the references continuing scholasticism in its greatest exponents has unshakably adhered to the demonstrability of the existence of god the scholastic proofs of god found their classical formulation in saint thomas aquinas it was only in the area in the era of late scholasticism that influential representatives of nominalism and then in parenthesis we have wilhelm habakkum nicholas of utrachor peter of i.e and parenthesis in consequence of their skepticism began to doubt the certainty of the proofs of god's existence these proofs are based on the absolute validity of the principles of causality movari means transition from potence to act while can't under the influence of david hume limited the validity of this to the world of experience st thomas establishes its transcendental validity which far surpasses the world of experience by reference to the section three errors regarding the natural no ability of god number one traditionalism traditionalism which developed as a reaction against rational against the rationalism of the enlightenment proceeds from the view that god in a camp in a comprehensive primitive revelation bestowed on man simultaneously with speech a sum of religious and moral basic truths which have been reproduced in mankind through tradition general reason or common sense guarantees the unfalsified transference of the original heritage of the revelation the individual receives it through oral teaching reason cannot achieve of itself the knowledge of the existence of god in parenthesis skepticism the knowledge of god is like every religious and moral knowledge and knowledge of faith the chief exponents of traditionalism in its strict form are lga de bonnau f de lemane and l e botan it was represented in a moderated form by a bonnetti and g ventura this theory was condemned by pope gregory the 16th pope pius ix and by the vatican council the semi-traditionalists of the school of law admit indeed that natural reason from the contemplation of natural things can with certainty recognize existence of god but only on the supposition that it has already through instruction imbibe the idea of god originating traditionalism is to be rejected on philosophical and theological grounds a the language does not generate concepts it presupposes them b acceptance of the revelation presupposes according to reason knowledge of the revealing god and the certain conviction of the truth of his two atheism the systems of agnosticism skepticism and canteen criticism deny the certain nobility of the and the demonstrability of the existence of god but can be associated with the belief in a in a divine being they are based on the principle we do not know and we shall not know ignoramus negative atheism is inculpable ignorance regarding the existence of god positive atheism materialism pantheism directly denies the existence of a super mundane personal divine being it was so we have the negative atheism sort of an agnosticism and then which is sort of invincible ignorance or an inculpable ignorance and then you have positive atheism which outright denies the nobility of the existence of god as far as a possibility of atheism is concerned it cannot be denied that there are atheistic doctrinal systems materialism pantheism and practical atheists that is people who live as if there were no god the possibility that there are also subjectively convinced theoretical atheists is founded in the spiritual and moral weakness of man and on the fact that the proofs of god are not immediately but only immediately evident but as the knowledge of god can easily be gained from the contemplation of nature in the life of the soul it will not be possible permanently to en to adhere to an honest and positive conviction of the non-existence of god an inculpable and invincible ignorance regarding the existence of god is not possible for a long time in a normal grown up person in view of the facility of the natural knowledge of god attested in holy writ kant's critique well i think you pronounce it can't while can't in his pre-critical period recognize the possibility of the proofs of god and even develop the ideological proof of god and then in parenthesis compare the article published in 1763 quote the only possible ground for proof ground the only possible ground of proof for a demonstration of the existence of god unquote that's what he uh that's how he characterizes his ideological proof of god as the only possible ground of proof for a demonstration of the existence of god in his critical period he denied the and then in parenthesis compare the critique of pure reason which appeared in 1781 end of parenthesis according to kant the only object of theoretical reason is the world of phenomena the super sensual is withdrawn from it the validity of the principle of causality is limited to things perceptible to the senses in order to refute the individual proofs of god's existence can't sought to show that they all go back to the ontological argument by deriving from the concept of the supreme reality its factual existence nevertheless kant believed in the existence of god and designated this belief to the postulate of practical reason kant's philosophy exercised a decisive influence on the protestant theology of the 19th century from the standpoint of the kantian doctrine of cognition it rejected the rational foundation of religion and with it the intellectual proofs of the existence of god and taught that religious truths must be perceived not by reason but through religious feeling which affirms the existence of god and by which we live in god they claim that it is on this subjective religious experience that faith is founded the consequence is a sharp separation of the spheres of knowledge and faith and then in parenthesis they have jacobi schleiermacher rich khloe and harnack i guess they're proponents of that uh canteen sort of form of protestantism number four modernism the cognition the cognitional theoretical basis of modernism is agnosticism according to which human rational cognition is limited to the world of experience religion according to this theory develops from the principle of vital imminence imminentism that is from the need for god which dwells in the human soul the truths of religion are according to the general progress of culture caught up in a constant substantial development interesting chapter two the supernatural nobility of the existence of god section four god's existence as an object of faith one dogma god's existence is not merely an object of natural rational knowledge but also an object of supernatural faith this is a de fide dogma the highest in the beginning of all the formulas of the faith stands the fundamental article i believe in one god the vatican council teaches the holy catholic apostolic roman church believes and confesses that there is a god the denial of god's existence is condemned as heresy by the same counsel according to hebrews 11 6 faith in the existence of god is an indispensable condition of salvation without faith quote without faith it is impossible to please god for he who wishes to approach god must believe that he is and that he is a rewarder to him to them that seek him end quote that's hebrews 11 6 but only supernatural faith in revelation is effective unto salvation the supernatural revelation of the existence of god confirms the natural knowledge of god and enables the existence of god to be known easily by all without certainty excuse me to be known easily by all with certainty and without any admixture of error relative or moral necessity of the let me read that again the supernatural revelation of the existence of god confirms the natural knowledge of god and enables the existence of god to be known easily by all with certainty and without any admixture of error relative or moral necessity of the revelation not sure i understand that relative or moral necessity of the revelation not sure why that's tagged on go back to that on my own time and look at that i'm not sure what that little tag is there number two knowledge and faith as regards the same object it is a disputed point whether one and the same person can at the same time have knowledge and faith in the existence of god many outstanding scholastic theologians alexander of hail saint bonaventure albertus magnus and many later theologians suarez assert that such is possible because the formal object is different natural insight versus divine revelation and because both acts or habits belong to different orders of being nature versus grace saint thomas on the contrary teaches it is impos it is impossible for the same truth to be known and believed by the as ground for this he submits that the clear insight into the truth associated with knowledge cannot coexist with the obscurity of faith it is however possible that the same truth could be known by one person and believed by another according to the teaching of saint thomas it is also possible for the same person at the one time to have a natural knowledge of the existence of god as the original as the originator of the natural order and a supernatural faith in the existence of god as the originator of the supernatural order because the supernatural faith comprehends truths which are not contained in natural knowledge and then in parenthesis difference of interesting so again we have the franciscans and the thomas moving on now section two the nature of god chapter one the knowledge of the nature of god section five the natural knowledge of the nature of god in this world as the knowledge of the existence of a thing is not possible without some cognition of its constitution so the natural knowledge of the existence of god there is always a certain knowledge so in the natural knowledge of the existence of god there is always a certain knowledge of his nature every single proof of god reveals a definite perfection of the divine nature the naturally achievable knowledge of god is deepened and extended one constitution of our natural knowledge of god in this world a immediate knowledge and here we have a dogma our natural knowledge of god in this world is not an immediate intuitive cognition but immediate abstractive knowledge because because it is attained through the knowledge of creatures sent certa in opposition to the teaching of the church ontologism they cite mal branch who died in 1715 and gioverti who died in 1852. ontologism teaches that even in this life we possess from nature an immediate intuitive knowledge of god and that in the light of the immediate knowledge of god we become cognizant of created things the order of knowledge must correspond to the order of being god as the first being must therefore also be the primary that is taught in opposition to the teaching of the church it's called ontologism ontologism is incompatible with the doctrine of the general council of vienna according to which the soul requires the supernatural light of glory for the immediate knowledge of god in 1861 and 1887 the holy office rejected several onto logistical holy proves on the one hand that the natural knowledge of god is attained through created things in parenthesis we have a comparison with wisdom 13 1 and parenthesis and on the other hand that no human being is capable of seeing god immediately but that the vision of god is reserved for the other life compare first timony first timothy 6 16 quote he inhabiteth light inaccessible whom no one have seen nor can see end quote and then first corinthians 13 12 quote now we see him through a glass in a dark manner but then face to face end quote ontologism also contradicts the testimony of consciousness and in its consequences leads to pantheism and rationalism the ontologists quite wrongly appeal to the teaching of saint augustine of the knowledge in razionibus eternis for saint augustine without doubt teaches immediate cognition of god which proceeds from the contemplation of the human soul or of the external world and many heretics want to appeal to saint augustine because he's such a genius but it doesn't hold in this case or in any other radical case b analogical cognition our knowledge of god here's another dogma our knowledge of god here below is not proper but hence the via negativa while cognition properly so-called comprehends an object through its own mental form or by immediate vision and a logical cognition comprehends an object through an alien form in the cognition of god in this world we apply concepts gained from the created things to god on the ground of a certain similarity and ordination of the created things to him as their efficient and exemplary cause there is a relation of analogy between the creatures and the creator which is found on the fact that the creature is necessarily made to the likeness of the creator this analogy is the basis of all natural knowledge of god compare wisdom 13 5. this so-called analogy of being is sharply rejected by k bart as the invention of antichrist despite this analogy or similarity there is a much greater dissimilarity between the creatures and the crater namely the dissimilarity between the finite and the two method of the natural knowledge of two method of the natural knowledge of god here below our cognition of god in taught by the threefold way of affirmation negation a the way of affirmation or causality proceeds from the consideration that god is the efficient cause of all things and that the efficient cause contains in itself every perfection which is in the effect from this it follows that god the originator of all creatures possesses every true perfection of the creatures the pure perfections are formally the mixed perfections which contain something finite in their concept are ascribed to god in a transferred sense metaphorically or anthropomorphically only so the pure perfections got belong properly to god they're formally ascribed to god the mixed perfections which contain something finite in their concept are ascribed to god in a transferred sense only that is to say in a metaphorical or b the way of negation denies to god every imperfection which is found in created things also the circumscription attached to imperfections of creative things deriving from their finiteness such negation of an imperfection implies affirmation and eminence for example infinite equals absence of limit under the influence of the theology of the neoplatonists certain individual fathers make use of such formulations as quote god is not substance not light not life not sense not spirit not wisdom not goodness end quote pseudo dionysius mysticus theologicous or whatever it is chapter three they do not wish to deny to god these perfections but to assert that these perfections do not belong to god in the same manner as they do to creatures but in an infinitely higher manner so if you've heard me talking about the via negativa this is what this is why we're allowed to say that god is not good okay it's not to deny the perfection of goodness it's just to say that god transcends in an infinite way the goodness that we know by analogy through creatures right we know the goodness of creatures but the goodness of it's only we can only speak in terms of analogy see the way of eminence enables us to deduce from the finite perfections of creatures the possession by god of infinite analogous perfections that's i often speak about how atheists acknowledge there's a good there's a better but they deny the best this is the three modes of cognition complement one another for the attributing of a perfection to god demands the attribution of it to him eminently and compare ecclesiasticus 43 29 saint john of damascus defeated number three improv imperfection of the knowledge of god here below god's nature this is a dogma god's nature is incomprehensible to men this the highest grade of certainty of any our knowledge of god in this world is a composition of many inadequate concepts and on account of this composition it is necessarily limited and imperfect the fourth lateran council 1215 and the vatican council call god incomprehensible the latter the lateran council also um here we have great in council and incomprehensible in thought that from jerome i think that must be saint jerome and then there's a citation from romans 11 33 how incomprehensible are his judgments how unsearchable his ways end quote the fathers notably saint basil saint gregory of nisa st john chris system defend the incomprehensibility of the divine essence by indicating the infinity and the sublimity of god in comparison with all creatures against the younomians who assumed an exhaustive that is to say adequate or comprehensive cognition of god and indeed even in this world saint augustine says quote more true than our speech about god is our thinking of him and more true than only god possesses a comprehensive knowledge of god for the infinite being can be completely comprehended by an infinite intellect only and then we have the sumo theologica citation here quote god whose being is infinite is infinitely knowable no creature no created understanding can however know god in an infinite manner end quote so i often talk about the distinction between apprehension and comprehension when it comes to uh knowing god we can apprehend god but we can never comprehend god not even in all eternity that that's how we will spend our heaven he is infinitely noble it's going to take all of eternity to explore that and to enjoy that four truth of the knowledge of god in this world although our knowledge of god in this world is imperfect still it is true because god really possesses the perfections attributed to him and because we are conscious of the analogous character of our knowledge of god and of our assertions concerning him i often use the analogy with uh atheists about the ocean you've been to the ocean you've touched the ocean you may even dived in and swam around but you have not plumbed its depths right you barely touched the tip of the iceberg so to speak section 6 the supernatural knowledge of the divine essence in the other world one reality of the immediate vision of god and here we have a dogma the blessed in heaven possess an immediate intuitive knowledge of the divine essence this is the highest grade of dogma the de fete grade of dogma the blessed in heaven possess an immediate intuitive knowledge of the divine essence that's called the beatific vision i think pope benedict x defined in the dogmatic constitution benedictus deus latin latin latin they the source of the just see the divine essence by an intuitive vision and face to face so that the divine essence is known immediately showing itself nakedly clearly and openly and not immediately that's the end of that reference and then it says the council of florence determined the object of the knowledge of god in the other world as follows to know god one and three as he is that's how the council of lawrence put it the most opposite passage in holy writ is first corinthians 13 12 in which the apostle contrasts the mirror like enigmatical and piecemeal knowledge of god in this world with the immediate and clear knowledge of god in the other world quote we see now through a glass in a dark manner but then face to face now i know in part but then i shall know even as i am known end quote saint john describes the future state which is prepared for the children of god on earth with the words quote we shall be like to him because we shall see him as he is end quote compare matthew 5 8 18 10 2nd the older fathers using the simple words of holy scripture teach that the angels and saints are vouchsafed a real vision of god and behold him face to face compare saint irena irenaeus the citation is there if you want to see it since the middle of the fourth century some fathers like saint basil the great saint gregory of nisa saint john chrysostom appear to dispute the possibility of an immediate vision of god their assertions in point of fact can however be explained as being directed against eunomius eunomius who claimed an immediate cognition of god even in this world in contrast to this the father stressed that the knowledge of god in this world is immediate in the next world immediate but not comprehensive st john chrysostom compares the vision of god in the other world with that with the sight of the transfigured christ on tabor and says quote what shall be said when royalty itself appears when the palace is opened and it is permitted to view the king himself no longer enigmatically nor in a glass but face to face no longer in faith two object of the immediate vision of god the primary object of the immediate vision of god is the infinite essence of b the secondary object consists in the extra divine things which are seen in the scope of this knowledge is different in the individual blessed blessed according to the grade of their immediate cognition of god the latter however is determined by the measure of their supernatural merits one may assume with saint thomas that the glorified spirit in god in any case sees all that pertains to it nothing is lacking to the knowledge of a beatus of things which pertain to him he knows all these in the word he knows all these in the word that from three supernatural character of the immediate vision of god the immediate this is a dogma the immediate vision of god transcends the natural power of cognition of the human soul and is therefore supernatural that's a de fide dogma the council of vienna 13 11 13 12 rejected the false teaching of the begards and the begins the soul does not need the light of glory elevating it to see and enjoy god that is condemned by the council of yanna it rejected that statement according to the general teaching of theologians the immediate vision of god is a gift absolutely exceeding the natural potentiality of every created and creatable intellect and hence it is holy scripture asserts that the immediate knowledge of the divine essence is inaccessible to natural reason first timothy 6 16 quote god habituth light inaccessible whom no one hath seen nor can see end quote the vision of the divine essence belongs by its very nature only to god john 1 18 quote no man hath seen god all the only begotten god who is in the bosom of the father hath declared him he hath declared him end quote compare matthew 11 27 john 6 46 first corinthians 2 11. speculatively the absolute supernatural character of the immediate vision of god may be demonstrated from the principle as the nature is so is the cognition when the mode of being of the object of cognition is higher than the mode of being of the subject of cognition then the latter is from its nature incapable of immediately knowing the object of cognition in its essence god is subsistent being ipsum essay subsistence while every created intellect has a communicated being essay participatum only every created an intellect has a communicated being only therefore it lies beyond the cognitive power of every created intellect immediately to know the essence of god compare the summa theologica on account of its absolute supernatural character the immediate vision of god is a mystery strict de dictum strictly so-called is a juan may with saint augustine and saint thomas assume that the human intellect can even on earth be elevated supernaturally and exceptionally to the immediate vision of god as examples are quoted moses and saint paul and that references are given there exodus 33 11 numbers 12 8 second corinthians 12 2 and following compare saint augustine and the references are given there and compare the four necessity of the light of glory for the immediate vision of god the possibility of the elevation of the soul to the immediate vision of god is founded on the one hand on the soul's likeness to god i.e on its immateriality and on the other hand on the omnipotence here we have another dogma the soul for the immediate vision of god requires the light of glory this is a deji day dogma lumen gloria is as necessary for the mode of cognition of the state of glory as is lumen ratzionis for the mode of cognition of the state of nature and lumen fidei for the mode of cognition of the state of faith it consists in a lasting supernatural perfection of the human power of cognition through which it is inwardly strengthened for the vital act of the immediate vision in its ontological nature it must be considered as supernatural as a supernatural operative habit it must be considered as a supernatural operative habit bestowed upon reason the habit of the light of glory dissolves the habit of faith the expression which is first found in saint bonaventura and saint thomas goes back to psalm 35 10. section seven the supernatural knowledge of the divine being in this world five limits to the immediate vision of god here we have another dogma god's essence is also incomprehensible to the blessed in heaven that's a de fide dogma the blessed in heaven also possess no adequate or comprehensive cognition of the divine being god is for every created spirit even in the state of supernatural elevation according to the vulcate okay so there was reference given to jerome and denzinger in the times of the father saint john chrysostom especially in his 12 homilies they incomprehensibly has defended the incomprehensibility of eunomians i think that comes from the the intrinsic basis of the incomprehensibility of god lies in the boundless abyss between the infinite divine spirit and the finite created spirit that finite spirit can understand the infinite essence of god in a finite section seven the supernatural knowledge of the divine being in this world through faith the order of grace in this world is a preliminary stage and a preparation for the glory in the world to come supernatural faith here below corresponds to the immediate vision of god in the other world wow faith is a kind of anticipation of the vision of god in the world to come cherish your faith people cherish your faith it's a gift relation one relation to the knowledge of god knowledge of faith is distinguished from natural knowledge of god by the principle of cognition brazil fide illustrator the means of cognition relevatio divina and the formal object god as he has known through revelation the principle object of supernatural faith lies in the mysteries of faith which are known by divine revelation non-possum my latin is no good the divine revelation guarantees the infallible certainty of the truths of faith the truths of faith have therefore a higher degree of certitude than the natural truths of reason amen but from the viewpoint of clarity or intelligibility the natural truths of reason are higher than the truths of faith because in the former we possess an inner insight in the latter however we do not in this sense the frequently cited saying of hugo of saint victor is valid hugo victor i'm getting error messages on my youtube live stream let's hope this is actually in this sense the frequently cited saying of hugo of saint victor is valid namely that the certitude of faith is of two relation to the immediate vision of god in relation to the vision of god in the other world the supernatural cognition of faith although it is also a participation in the divine self-cognition is still imperfect the basic truths of faith are beyond the power of comprehension to the of the human reason and even after the revelation still remain obscure and mysterious second corinthians 5 7 quote we walk by faith and not by sight end quote as supernatural revelation takes its concepts from the created world so also the cognition of faith is analogical first corinthians 13 12 quote now we see through a glass in a dark manner end i'm going to leave it there we are at and i hope such that we can actually hear what i was reading so it's very very interesting stuff very good stuff but i'm going to stop the stream now and i'll continue this probably on sunday so take care of yourselves thanks for you

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