Catholic vs. Catholic - 2019-04-20 - Bryan Mercier

Author Recorded Saturday April 20th, 2019

There are 44 episodes in the Versus:Catholic series.

Recorded September 13th, 2017

Catholic vs. Catholic - 2017-09-13 - Thomas

Bryan is a passionate and knowledgeable Catholic speaker, retreat leader, author, and apologist. He speaks at colleges and universities, conferences, live and on the internet, television and radio. For more info visit catholicbryan.org


Catholic vs. Catholic - 2019-04-20 - Bryan Mercier

Author Recorded July 26th, 2017

audio


video

transcript
These transcripts are generated automatically and are therefore unformatted and replete with errors.
hi my name is Brian Mercier and you are listening to Catholic versus Catholic so tell us a little bit about yourself if you would please who you are what you believe and why you believe it sure I am Brian Mercier and I am Catholic passionately Catholic 100% unapologetically Catholic and I wasn't always this way and in fact I grew up in a Catholic family the oldest of six kids but if you looked at me today you wouldn't recognize me from what I was in high school and in college I actually used to dress in all black I used to carry weapons I used to want to hurt people I was very angry I was very depressed I didn't even look in the mirror for seven years because I hated what I saw I really didn't like myself even though my mom taught me to pray every day since I was a kid every day since I was three I prayed and I never stopped praying even when I went through doubts even when God didn't answer my prayers even when catastrophes happened or bad things happened I kept praying but I went down a very dark path for a long time about seven years and my mom was very concerned about me especially when she found weapons and other things in my room and I had a lot of death poetry where I wanted to kill people and that sort of thing and so my mom didn't know what to do with me so instead of calling a police on her son she decided to send me out to a Catholic College the best Catholic college in America no bias Franciscan University of Steubenville Ohio and it was there that I actually found God in a very powerful way I counted of Jesus and he literally transformed my life upside down and backwards for the better he took out all of my hate in my rage and he replaced it with peace and love he took out all of my sadness and my brokenness and my confusion and he replaced it and filled me with an overflowing bubbly happiness and a bubbly joy that I've had for 20 years ever since and so I would say that not only do I know of God but I feel like I know God I feel him I experience him he works in my life and it's powerful after I really knew God I used to go to what's known in his abortion in Pittsburgh Pennsylvania where we pray that the mothers would have their kids and not have abortions now everybody knew that the Catholics would come out by the hundreds and the hundreds there every week and so all of the anti Catholics used to calm Mormons Jehovah's Witnesses fundamentalist Protestants pep tiss all of them and they used to try to take Catholics away and tell us we worship Mary and tell us that well show me in the Bible where it says the word Pope and I'll convert today show me where in the Bible it says that show me where in the Bible it says that simultaneously earned into two jehovah's witnesses who said hi you're catholic great did you know that your church was started by the pagan Emperor Constantine who blended Christianity and he blended paganism and the result was Catholicism not fully pagan not fully Christian but a blend of the two they also said that you believe Jesus is God but that can't be because jesus said the father is greater than I so if the father is greater than Jesus and Jesus admits that then how can he be God and if he was praying to God in the Garden of Gethsemane then how can he be God and so question after question they asked me and I literally had no answer I knew I loved God but I couldn't answer any of these objections from these people and it really shook my faith and I started questioning it and I said well how do I know the Catholic religions right how do I know any religions right I've just been told by my mother that it is and she was probably told by her mother and her mother in fact it's probably just something cultural passed down so that kind of put me on a very long search to studying the Catholic faith to see if it was real to see if it was true I studied a lot of the other religions also just in case because I don't want to believe something that's not true and if Catholicism isn't true I don't want to believe it so that kind of led me into apologetics and about six months later I became very knowledgeable in my faith and I was chasing after the Jehovah's Witnesses and the Protestants and we were having these long discussions and now 15 years later 20 years later I'm still doing apologetics teaching it and so other people don't have to be as awkward as I am but right now you ask me what I believe I believe in God I believe in Jesus Christ who saved my life and saved me and I believe that his church is the Catholic Church one Holy Catholic and Apostolic nice paint a little picture if you would please of two things first your very earliest memories of religion and God whatever it was your first memory about religion the second part of the question is about your family is everyone devout and pious and really on fire for the faith were there some that have drifted away and then come back like yourself just sort of a landscape like that please yeah sure so I guess my earliest memories of God and faith were given to me by my mother who taught me to pray since I could speak she taught me to pray since practically I was about three years old and and when I was around four and five that whole time she every night before we went to bed we had to thank God for some things in our life and we always had to ask God for things that we wanted you know I asked for a bunny and a bike and you know really childish things and by the time I got to high school I was pretty much praying the same way who wasn't a bunny or a bike it was a girlfriend in a car but I never really got to pray in a deep level my mom taught me to pray she told me to pray the rosary every day by the time I got to middle school which I did but my earliest memories were just really tossing prayers up to God just tossing them up to this target in the sky that I believed in but I didn't know who he was and that would be a pattern through high school and even into college where I felt like God wasn't really real in my life in the sense that I couldn't feel him I couldn't experience him it was more of just this nice idea up there but I didn't feel like he was actually working in my life and I didn't feel like he was a real presence in my life at that time simultaneously my dad was a very angry man at the time and he gave me a lot of bad ideas of anger and revenge and of that sort of thing and I guess psychology tells you that a lot of times you put your image of your father on to God and so it'd take me years to have a good image of God not somebody who's angry who is pounding his fists who's always mad at you if you do something right great you're supposed to do it you don't get a reward but if you do something bad you're gonna hear about it and you may even go to hell so I'd a very fearful relationship with God growing up many times not in my earliest years but once I started to actually ask questions and think about it I actually really had a hard time knowing who God was and I would have to receive a really big healing later on to answer your second question I would say that all but one of my siblings is Catholic they've been coming back more and more especially two of my siblings have just recently come back and they're going to a duration and they're saying the rosary and they're doing really living their faith which is great and that I have another sister who really lives her faith and then a couple who are kind of in-between so I would say the majority of my family lives their faith except for one of my siblings who is questioning our how's your relationship with your dad nowadays it's good growing up with both my mom and my dad it was terrible but nowadays it's good with both of them and they get along they're still together actually one of the things that I got mad for was that I asked my parents not to separate or get divorced and they did and so I figured either God wasn't real or he wasn't listening to me or he was listening but he was like this old man with a white beard billions of light years away and he just tossed your prayers up to him but my siblings and I we kept praying and we kept praying and we kept praying and my parents actually got back together about seven years later and they're doing much better today I mean they go to the Latin Mass they say rosaries together they went on a second honeymoon they're in a new house I mean my dad is nor my mom neither of them are remotely the same people that they used to be they're both so much better well when you talk with your parents especially your mom what is their attitude when you reflect on those dark years well first I would like to say that the half the reason I'm Catholic is because she told me to pray the rosary every day and I never gave up on God and I continued praying that powerful prayer which really helped me because I had Mary praying for me all those years but I also had my mom praying for me all those years suffering for me praying for me crying for me just begging God every single day for me so she was always an instrumental part of my faith but she didn't know really how bad it got until she heard my testimony at a talk I gave once and recently she's actually come out a few times to me and she just cries and she just breaks down sobbing because she feels bad that she didn't know how to handle a wild child like me and she probably didn't do it right and she feels bad she made so many mistakes as a mother and you know I said mom it's fine it made me the person I am today you know we don't have a manual of how to raise kids we just don't know but you prayed for me you sacrificed me mean you helped me to get where I am today so we can talk about it today and she comes to me now for all her faith questions and anything that she has to run by me or talk about so we have a good relationship in that aspect I've got a couple of questions about the charismatic movement because you went to the Franciscan University of Steubenville and they're sort of loosely associated rightly or wrongly with the charismatic movement I've only heard good things about that University but I read one book about magic Ori that was critical of certainly of magical area as being demonic but by association Steubenville was implicated as sort of being co-opted by a dark branch of the charismatic movement I don't know much about it but I was surprised to hear anything negative about the Franciscan University of student ville can you just talk about that please sure and this actually has to do with another sector of my conversion story because when I got to Steubenville I was angry as you know and I swore used curse words every other word and I was very angry and I just said I'm not gonna pray the rosary I don't want to I'm not gonna go to Mass if I don't want to little did I know that everybody I think they said about 90 something percent of the campus goes to mass every all day many of them go to confession every week I mean you want to talk about the ultimate Catholic bubble that's where it is and if you have any problems with that it's like the ultimate peer pressure you know everybody goes so everyone's like oh you're gonna go to church you're gonna go to church so finally I kids and I started going to church more than once a week now half of Franciscan University at least when I was there is very very traditional and they want nothing to do with the charismatic movement meanwhile the charismatic people there are very charismatic and they really want nothing to do with the traditional and so the priests they're actually spent a lot of time saying that these are two different sides of the church and they used to try to bring them together as one in a sense and what I mean by that is if you want to be charismatic in the Protestant world you have to be Pentecostal there's no room for that in almost any of the other churches especially Baptist or fundamentalist or Episcopalian or anything like that but if you want a good bible-believing Church that only goes by the Bible hardly has any music maybe an organ then you're talking Baptist so each Protestant denomination seems to have a different flavor but what these priests were saying is we have everything under one roof in the Catholic Church we have Dominicans who are one spirituality then we have Carthusians who are another and Jesuits and Franciscans who are others but we also have the tradition of the Catholic Church which we could never lose but yet at the same time I mean it even says this in the Bible in the book of Romans and in other books God has given us charisms to build up the church and so we need to use these charisms and become more open to the Holy Spirit in him working in our lives so that we can not only have this having gifts of the Holy Spirit and become holy ourselves but we can use the charisms of the Holy Spirit to go out and anoint others and help to bless them now at this time in my history I was super anti charismatic I had never even heard of this when I got to Steubenville I grew up in traditional parishes I knew of the organ and no other instrument so when I got out his Franciscan University and people were putting their hands in the air and people were speaking in tongues and people were doing all this weird mumbo job I thought it was just so silly and I used to actually stare at people and try to make them feel awkward because that's how they made me feel now fast forward a few months they have these events as Steubenville once a month and they're called festival of praises where you just listen to praise and worship music they have a live band there and they play for two and a half to three hours and you just praise God for that time they start out with really fast songs and then they get it down to more like adoration songs where you just have more quiet time to reflect and I refused staunchly to go to these but after a while I caved and I said I'll go there once God if you can't convince me I'm not coming back eventually I ended up long story short I ended up becoming very charismatic and I had a very profound experience I probably the single most powerful encounter of my entire life and it was when God asked me and I felt strongly that he was asking me to put my hands in the air and at the time I was such a good Catholic that I told him no I'm not gonna put my hands up in the air God but he didn't make me he didn't use force but he gently said just take a chance just take a chance prayin just put your hands up in the air and I said no no no no but eventually I said okay god it's gonna make you happy fine I'll put my silly hands in the air and God doesn't usually work with people who give them a bad attitude but I guess he human me that day because I'm super stubborn sometimes and I put my hands up just a little bit not all the way up like everybody else but just a little bit and he it'd be so hard I mean I had the most profound powerful experience and I guess looking backwards hindsight is 20/20 they say but looking backwards that's all God wanted me to do the hands were just symbolic of that but he wanted me to take a step and surrender to him give up all my years of pain my hurt my anger my confusion my rage I'm everything he just wanted to take that from me and long story short he did he promised me a new heart and a new mind and when he gave me that new heart in a new mind I mean I was literally completely a different person I've been filled with his love inside and out from head-to-toe ever since that's changed the way I do everything including apologetics including evangelization in just the way I live my life I just he just filled me to overflowing with his presence and so uh I guess to answer your question I consider myself both I love the tradition of the church and I love adoration I even go to a lot mass sometimes my wife was in a scola but I'm also very charismatic in the sense that I sometimes pray with my hands open as a scientific my praise and my prayers up to God and as a sign that I need to receive what he has for me - he has gifts and so often we just give give give and we don't actually remember to receive what he has for us so I guess I'm both and I think that Franciscan University is probably one of the healthiest versions of the charismatic movement if it's part of that I don't often see the charismatic movement done well but at Steubenville it was extremely reverent and with very few abuses and any abuses that were found they would correct him immediately and just briefly talk about your perspective on the alleged apparitions at metric Coria police I am of the opinion if you're asking my opinion I'm not the church but I'm of the opinion that magic aurilla is not from God it's not a real apparition and I personally don't believe it if the Church says it's true I'll obey but until then you can't convince me I listen to a one-hour podcast by Jimmy akin who went through all the documents all the bishops all the writings all the statements all the censorships that the church has put out on it and it's pretty convincing that at least right now that church has said no and they've even said you're not allowed to call the suppose that apparition Our Lady you're not allowed to call it Mary or our mother or anything like that so at best I think we have to treat it as an alleged apparition but at worst and this is my feeling personally based off the visionary and as well that I just don't really feel like it is yeah disobedience is a I think of red flag all the disobedience that's associated with it and some of the teachings that have come out of the the so called gospel but we don't need dwell on that but what would you say to someone that's very very excited by the fact that they've seen so many people come back refreshed and they get on fire for the faith what would you say to those people I would actually say a couple of things first of all I always point to father Donald callaway are you familiar with him no no oh my gosh you need to listen to him just look him up when you get off of this and listen to his testimony okay he was a priest who actually was like a modern-day Saint Paul he did sex drugs in rock and roll and he's one of the only people in the world ever to get kicked out of the country of Japan because he stole millions of yen and he had all these women and he actually broke out of jail I believe and they actually chased him with dogs and he opened up a manhole cover in in hid in manure like sludge up to his neck and the dogs still found him they brought him back to jail and he ended up he was a terrible person he really was incredibly mean to his parents he hated them and he was angry but he eventually had the most profound conversion and it happened through magic Oriya and even he says that it is not approved it's a alleged apparition and he says that Mary and Jesus can work in this situation because these people are sincerely seeking Jesus they're sincerely trying to find more of their faith and so God can work with that even if the apparition or the circumstances aren't good or godly I mean we could say the same thing for Protestants I wasn't being fed and then I joined the Mormon Church and now I feel like I'm fed you know it's it's very individual it's not objective it's very subjective and the Protestants you know we believe they receive the Holy Spirit in some sense in some way they have big conversions they have a lot of it but it doesn't mean that their church is true it doesn't mean they have the truth it just means that God is using them because they're sincerely seeking them in fact in the book of Acts I believe it was st. Peter who said now I see that God works in people's lives who since si seek him from all different kind of backgrounds and levels of faith and that sort of thing so I think God does work with Protestantism not because it's true but because they sincerely seek Him and he's leading everybody where they're at and not where they should be yeah yeah yeah st. Augusta and famously said that you have the Holy Spirit but only in proportion to your love for the Holy Roman Catholic Church so he made the direct connection that people can have the Holy Spirit in varying degrees but the more you love the Catholic Church the more you have the Holy Spirit so the Second Vatican Council talks about this very nicely I think about how there are means of salvation outside of the church but all of those means of salvation are Catholic that we should make no mistake about it if there are means of salvation in these Protestant churches they are Catholic means of salvation I always think in terms of Noah's Ark there's only one art and you have to be in the ark when the door is closed and if people are on their way in if they get into Noah's Ark they will be Catholic and if they don't make it in to Noah's Ark they will not be Catholic so can we talk a little bit about Christian unity how to dialogue how to bring people in and if you can then please go on to talk about non-christians and then even further to talk about atheists you know that that extreme end where people don't even acknowledge their their maker how do we dialogue with these people most effectively sure and that's a great question and it's something that I've been teaching people to do and I've been preaching on for years and years you know in the talks that I give at the conference's that I speak at I think it's very important we do this because we've done it bad for so long on one extreme you have people who just want to be nice and everybody's accepted and as long as you're sincere you can be saved and then on the other hand you have you know red treads or even a lot of traditional Catholics they might be right but they're jerks they're in your face they're rude they're arrogant they call you names and they basically act like the pagans that they're condemning and Christ calls us to be so much more such a higher standard in our dialogues in in Vangelis Asian and Vatican 2 talks about that in a beautiful way for myself I learned about this the hard way after I really learned my faith and I could quote Protestants five to one with Bible verses and that sort of thing and I was pretty confident and even cocky and I brought out the holy sledgehammer and I just let them have it of why they were all wrong and why would they were going to hell if they weren't Catholic and all that sort of thing after one particular heated conversation with a Protestant on a street corner I walked away angry and immediately this woman comes up to me at the abortion mill and she gets right in my face like I can practically feel her spitting in my face she's almost nose-to-nose with me and she sticks her finger right in my nose and she says you have no right to be here you're not a woman you know nothing about women's reproductive rights you know nothing at all so just get out of here you're a man and she was going on and on and I already angry I just fought fire with fire and so I said well you know nothing about Jesus and you know nothing about truth and morality you're a baby murderer and you're on your way to hell and all of this other thing I was like you're lecturing me and you're murdering babies and so I gave her this whole tirade but I was like so happy with myself and I patted myself on the back as I walked away in a huff and I didn't know what to say except that ten minutes later I was so angry took me ten minutes to come down and during that time I came back to her and what I saw I would change my life for ever my friend Bridget who couldn't explain her faith to save her soul she couldn't do apologetics at all she didn't know anything and yet she was sitting on the cement indian-style with her legs crossed and she was just holding this woman in her lap the woman was laying on the cement and her head was in Bridget's lap and Bridget was just stroking her hair so gently so kindly so lovingly and this woman was literally bawling her eyes out she was coughing up her lungs she was crying so hard and all I could do as I was frozen there watching this and I said to myself I said what it what what it Bridget do well how did she get through her she can't explain her faith she doesn't know apologetics how did she get through to this lady and finally make her break down and see how dumb she is this is how hard-hearted I was and Fick headed I was and it was at that moment that God struck me with like a lightning bolt of Revelation and he basically showed me in that moment that it's all about love if you don't have love then you have nothing if you have the truth but you don't have love you're a jerk if you have love but you don't have the truth you're just a nice person and it's wishy-washy we need both truth without compromise and we need passionate love for the other person so from that day on for some reason God just gave me a singular grace that I didn't get angry with people when they yelled at me and I didn't get angry when they started condemning the Catholic Church I actually felt bad for them that they hadn't had a chance to know the truth or that they had been lied to about the Catholic faith and I was so inspired and joyful that I had the opportunity to clear up their misconceptions and to share that with them so I think whether you are a Protestant Christian or whether you are an atheist non-believer I think that's the attitude that we need to take with every single person stop trying to win arguments and start trying to win souls stop trying to actually convert people and just plant seeds pray for them and let God do the rest especially if they're really hard-hearted and they're really stubborn you're not gonna do it you can't you can't do anything I can't either only the Holy Spirit can do that heavy type of lifting and I wrote a book called why do you believe in God and has 15 conversations with actual real atheists so you get to hear both sides but in that book I give a lot of apologetic advice - and I show that this person listened and this person didn't and I felt called not to continue the conversation because I felt like I'd planted enough seats and I'm just going to pray for them and if add many atheists come back and tell me that hey because of our conversations I believe in God now or I believe in Jesus now I'm going to start going to church and that sort of thing because that's what God does he saves souls and changes lives we just want it to happen now and we don't we don't see fruit we don't see anything happening we're like oh it's not happening but God has his perfect plan and his perfect time to bring these people about so that they don't fall back into sin and maybe go back further than they were but that they can be fully converted in him so as far as Protestants I don't really deal with them as much anymore because I feel like the whole nation is becoming pagan so I feel like I deal with a lot of more atheists now agnostics skeptics moral relativists I feel like my apologetics have gone that way because that's the majority of the people that I talk to you know and my youtube channel or just our retreats I speak in that sort of thing but for Protestants you have to know the Bible and you have to know it well you have to be able to talk to them in their tongue in a sense but I also think you need to know church history well because that's something they don't know and if you can get them to see it you can get them to see that their religion is not true sure everything they have everything good they have they got from us they received it from us the Bible they love the Bible and they love to quote it at us they would not even have a Bible if it wasn't the Catholic Church who put it together if it wasn't the Catholic Church who copied it for over a thousand years letter by letter line by line if it wasn't for the Catholic Church who saved Bibles when barbarians and Vikings were burning libraries to the ground and we were risking our lives to save the Holy Word of God and if it wasn't for the Catholic Church who translated it into many different languages even before Luther got his out so the Bible is a Catholic book and we need to know it and reclaim it as far as non Christians Muslims and people like that I think that's a more difficult task because we don't share as many things in common I think when you talk to people in general you need to find the common ground with anyone and then go from there but especially with Muslims and Jewish people you need to find a common ground my personal technique of evangelization a lot of times when I don't know a lot about the other religions and I don't know how to evangelize them well I asked a ton of questions I'm a bird is the Socratic method Allah and I ask a lot of questions to understand where they're coming from and only when you understand why they're fully coming from then you can find the holes in it and deal with them finally with atheism I always ask people are you really an atheist do you know for a fact that God doesn't exist or are you more of an agnostic you you're not sure you're somewhere in between you haven't seen any evidence for God he may be there he may not be you're not sure that's kind of where I start with atheists or another approach to take with atheists is tell me about the God you don't believe in well I don't believe in a God that does this this and this that kills babies you know and murders all these people I don't believe in that kind of God either this is the kind of God I believe in another approach I take with atheists and agnostics is to say hey did you ever believe in God when did you believe in God and what made you lose faith what caused you to lose faith because for me unless I know the root cause of why they've become what they are you could keep clipping branches off their tree all day and dealing with all their arguments but what I found is most atheists are atheists because well we'll just say for emotional reasons they're not intellectual reasons though they will give you those they are for emotional reasons I was hurt God didn't answer my prayers my grandmother died of cancer and he didn't do anything if he was real he would have done something I want to live out my homosexual lifestyle and I don't agree with the Bible and whatever it is a lot of times it's just not it's not because God's not real it's because they don't want to obey Authority they don't want to follow rules it's a lot of other things they've been really hurt so I try to get to the root cause of what it is and once you have that aha moment then you can really have that deep conversation of how to get them from point A to point B but that's going to take a long time usually and it's gonna take a lot of prayer and fasting mm-hmm I just want to get your thoughts on sex marriage the family these sort of foundational elements of society and of the world that God created this highest good of sex and marriage is being sullied it's being disrespected so I see a lot of people attracted to sort of a cheapened version of sex and intimacy and marriage and family can you just talk about those issues please sure I think on I think it's a two-pronged answer I think on the one hand we have not had good catechesis over the last 60 years since Vatican 2 I think there was a perfect storm at the time of Vatican 2 and there's a perfect book I want to recommend to you or to your listeners and it's called the decline and fall of the Catholic Church in America now what applies to the United States of America also applies to Canada and to other countries as well for sure after Vatican 2 you know there were a lot of liberals in Vatican 2 who tried to poison the well and they tried to get their way and the Pope tried to put the brakes on a lot of that they actually removed a lot of the liberal bishops who were writing documents and they put in more conservative bishops who would write the documents instead and this got the liberals very angry that they didn't get their way in a lot of avenues and in a lot of the areas and so they kind of had this rebellion afterwards once Vatican 2 happened all these liberals just implemented it in their own way and they literally sought to destroy the church and this was times 100 after the encyclical Humana vitae was written when the Catholic Church said no to contraception and kind of dropped a bomb on that the Liberals went crazy and basically started telling people don't obey the church the church is wrong about this the church doesn't know what it's talking about the Pope doesn't know what it's talking about he made a mistake you need to go with your own conscience follow your own conscience and this is the biggest satanic evil and the probably in our generation one of them because we literally crippled the authority of the church we think that we know better than the church we think that we're the Pope oh well I think abortion is okay well I think contraception is okay well if you really love each other you should be able to sleep together IIIi think this this and this but you're not God God already made the rules in you're not him so all you need to do is choose to obey or not Lucifer didn't obey if you choose not to obey you're on his side so you need to choose right now so we have a literal war in our church where after Vatican 250 thousand nuns left our church at the same time to join the sexual revolution in the anarchy and everything else that was happening the New Age movement 10,000 priests left the church at the same time as well but worse thousands and thousands of priests stayed in the church to try to change it into something else because they didn't like the Catholic Church as a moral authority so they tried to get rid of the morality in the church then we have tons of feminists arising at this time radical feminists and theologians and I put that in quotes because they can't even remotely be called theologians or Catholic because they basically were saying pornography is okay homosexuality is okay sex before marriage married priests contraception they were literally trying to change the church on all of these issues and it has caused a tidal wave of confusion among the laity who don't know better because we haven't been catechized since these times and is being passed into seminaries and that's why the seminaries cracked and we had to fill the void of all those priests still up the church so we took away the seminary laws and we took away psychological evaluations and we let any priest come into the church pretty much which is why we let all these terrible priests come into the church who did all the sexual abuse scandals because nobody was monitoring them and they were saying it's okay in the first place so that time I mean that's why most of the sex abuse scandals like over 90% of them happened 30 to 50 years ago during this confusion during this time but ever since then Catholics have not followed the church they've followed their own conscience we do what we want to do and we've lost Holy Mother Church and we've even rejected innocence Jesus Christ we've also rejected him because the Catholic Church is not the one who made up the rules God has and we've shot the messenger the Catholic Church so that's the one prong answers that religious education has been terrible passing on the faith has been terrible and we just don't know better today especially in our sects saturated cultures but on the other hand is the sex saturated culture I mean we have Catholics all over the place watching Game of Thrones I watched one episode of Game of Thrones with nudity and rape and incest and all of these disgusting things that are of the devil and we sit there and watch them and all I could think of in that mall and was how much we compromised our faith today just because we're so bred and washed by our culture radix is a Catholic group that does a one-man Passion Play and during their Passion Play they said this they say that during the Roman times they were so evil they had all of these sexual perversions they had all of this violence and Coliseum's and graphic killing and all of these different things and we condemn them for being such an immoral civilization and yet we watch the same things in our movies on TV and we actually pay money to watch other people's sin we pay money to watch other people participate in mortal sin so if Catholics can't even live their faith today and if Catholics are compromising and if Catholics aren't living for Christ's holy and are selling out in a sense how is the rest of the world's gonna know we need to bring back what our church is about it in fact that's why I just started my nonprofit organization called Catholic truth because that's what we need to get back to Catholic truth there's a lot of opinions but nobody cares about your opinion we only care about God's truth and my organization Catholic truth is going to be preaching that and it's going to be the place that people can come to know exactly what the Catholic Church teaches why it teaches it and why we believe what we believe and why it's gonna make you happy in life and get you to heaven so I don't know how to fix this problem I mean sexual rebellion right now is just so rampant the majority of Catholics are sleeping with each other the majority of Catholics are using contraception and the majority of Catholics are divorced and living like the rest of the world so I think the first step is calling them to holiness and really giving the truth in what it is and living it without compromise when we start doing that we're gonna start drawing people back to us but as long as it's compromising in our lives and in the lives of our priests and the lives of our bishops as long as they're not speaking out as long as they're not saying it we need the Holy Spirit the power of Samson The Passion of David to just fill them with a new Pentecost and if they can preach unabashedly the truth of Jesus Christ and the Catholic they if we can't even do that I don't know how we're gonna get back to where we are hmm are you familiar with the sensus fidelium youtube channel not too much I mean I know who they are yes okay I sort of had a life-changing moment where I listen to what they call a traditional priest giving a lecture on Mary how she's the Alpha and Omega of the Catholic Church it's a wonderful lecture and part of that lecture he mentioned in an offhand way that a theistic evolution is false because there's only one Immaculate Conception it's our Blessed Mother the Blessed Virgin Mary and therefore Adam cannot be immaculately conceived in the womb of a lower animal therefore he was created by special creation and theistic evolution is not even an option for Catholics and that sort of woke me up and I have since I listened to that lecture considered myself card-carrying young earth creationist in spite of all the mountains of evidence that seem to be stacked up against that position in terms of the natural sciences and it does seem absolutely contrary to all of the evidence can you just talk about that and talk about Genesis talk about the Immaculate Conception and just I'd be interested to hear your ideas on that place sure I think if all the mountains of evidence are against it there's probably a good reason for that I'm definitely not a young earth creationist and I don't know why but I can't figure it out except for their fundamentalism in a sense but really very very traditional people all seem to be young earth creationists and it's almost like a little cults to me if I can just be honest and now they won't even consider science or anything else I feel like they're like fundamentalist Protestants who will not even consider it because this is what the Bible says and they hold everything so literally I mean especially since the Catholic Church doesn't have a stance on it but seems more so to favor evolution and non creationism in fact I believe it's the last four or five popes have spoken out in favor of evolution or seeming to say that it's true and Pope Benedict as you probably know even wrote a whole book on it called in the beginning and talks about Genesis and how that relates to our understanding with science but the bottom line is that the Catholic Church goes with science we're not anti science we don't try to find all these other things that totally contradict science of science says it and it seems to be have a wealth of argumentation that supports it then you know one we don't go against that unless there's a really really good reason to do that I personally have never found the young creationists or the young earth arguments satisfying I find people who have a mindset of what they believe already and then just go look for the evidence to see how they can prove their point kind of like atheists decide that God doesn't exist of beforehand and then just look up the evidence that proves their point rather than just coming to the table with all the evidence and say hey let's just see where it leads where does this information lead and we're just gonna go wherever it leads so I personally go by science I'm not against science in fact the co-founder of evolution was a very big Catholic scientist Alfred Wallace he dwarfed Darwin in his knowledge of science and evolution and he actually spoke very highly of it in a lot of ways and so as the Catholic Church since then so as far as the Immaculate Conception you know that's interesting I've actually never heard that I probably have to think about it more but I guess just off the cuff and you know maybe you and I can talk about it another time and more deeply but just off the cuff it's for me it's not the same because Mary was kept sinless by a special grace of God so that she could sinlessly bear the sinless son of God so she was immaculately conceived for a reason Adam and Eve for what we know today as the first Homo sapiens what we would know today as authentically human and we believe that God had some hand in that evolutionary process it was not blind chance that God did come in infuse a soul a rational soul a supernatural soul and he had a hand in adam's creation specifically it just didn't come up by accident he some I guess mostly human thing that didn't even have a fully rational soul popped out a fully rational human who happened to be perfect I mean Genesis is not meant to be taken literally and the Catholic Church does not take it literally today Pope Benedict speaks about this at length in his book I mean even the seven days of creation aren't literal obviously because the Sun and the moon and the stars and all of what we know about time and how to keep time they weren't even created until the fourth day according to Genesis and so accordingly you couldn't have seven literal days even Saint Agustin 1600 years ago said those days weren't literal and things in Genesis aren't always literal they were meant to communicate a story of how man fell and disobeyed God but the things in that story might not all be exact literal fact so what Genesis is not saying it's not a science book saying how everything came about nowhere in the bible does it say that I mean that's not the purpose of Genesis the purpose of Genesis was to tell us that guy had created everything he made everything perfect man messed that up and so did the devil we've had sin ever since and God needs to redeem us from that so what scholars say is that the first 11 chapters of Genesis are in fact more of a story it's not a story like it's just symbolic or people say oh Genesis isn't true it's just a myth but no it's not that kind of a myth it actually did happen we actually did have two first parents we actually did have the devil whether he was a talking snake or not may or may not have been I mean he was a fallen angel who may or may not have taken on the form of a snake but the bottom line is there was a devil he did tempt them they did fail and sin did enter into the world because of them yeah but I did want to ask you about the evolution of the lower beasts the lower animals and all the death and decay and disease that would have been cluttering up the Garden of Eden I do honestly sincerely prefer much prefer the idea that God made out of nothing a perfect world with perfect health and there's no death and disease even among the animals and the trees I don't want to see trees even having disease in the perfect garden of paradise so it does bother me and the other thing I'd like you to address is the Atheist argument against theistic evolution where they say it's absolutely ridiculous and preposterous and naive to look at the scientific data of evolution and to point to a first human pair where their parents were not human and then they are human and all their offspring are human that's absolutely contrary to the model of evolution and if you think that theistic evolution can give you one human pair from which all humans flow then you just don't understand population genetics you just don't have a clue there's a process involved there's a gray zone there's some back and forth and it says it's a very ill-defined sort of thing that's what they say so what do you say in response to those two objections that I raised for you I can't remember the other one but you have death and disease all the trees and all the plant life and all the animal life oh yeah well as far as that goes and as far as that's concerned I mean I feel like that's just some aspect of the devil being on this earth kind of poisoning the animals in some way I mean we do know that the devil can take animals just like it did in the story where Jesus cast out the demons and it took over 2,000 pigs and they all ran headlong into the ocean and died I mean in theory the devil could have some effect over animals and you know kind of Mar that in a sense as well but again we don't really have a lot of information so it's more just theological theories and that sort of thing but you know as far as Adam goes once sin comes into the world then all of creation is marred and affected but I think that's personally why you know even if the devil did affect creation and it was imperfect in some sense well God saved Adam and Eve from that by putting them in a perfect Garden to live that way until they to reject a God and ended up being cast out into the rest of the world and in some ways everything could be seen as ridiculous in some ways I could see what they're saying with the ridiculousness of it if and only if God doesn't exist if God does exist then it's not ridiculous at all they're just postulating that because they don't think a higher power can have any effect on it but I just turned that around and I say well I personally think that your view of cosmology in the world is ridiculous do you think we came about by nothing from nothing because of nothing and it all just happened for no reason whatsoever it just happened billions and trillions and trillions of accidents some dead stuff I don't know matter at some point at some time some dead stuff created itself even though that's impossible because it's dead and even though it's scientifically impossible to move it's somehow moved itself and made other stuff it made everything we know yeah that makes a lot of sense mr. atheist and you're making fun of Catholics for their beliefs oh say or even more ridiculous in my view and hypocritical is that no it didn't come from nothing it was just always there no explanation we don't know yet we probably will never know because he can't traverse trillions of years backwards into time and you just can't know so we just say everything was there even though we don't know that I mean they make fun of us for saying that God has always been there even though God is outside of space and time and is internal but they're saying that things that are in space and time and the universe is even if you take bouncing universes there are any of these God particles or other theories out there they're just saying it's there and it's been going on for eternity infinity with no explanation so in some sense they have just as much of waki explanation of cosmology as we do and in my opinion much more so it's much more easy for me to believe that something alive that had the power to move that has the power to create that has the power to do something full actuality it can actualize things into motion it is much more reasonable than dead stuff moving dead stuff creating and dead stuff making everything is perfect as we know today yeah I find it a little bit odd that my podcast is called Catholic verses and yet more than half of my listeners are atheists can you talk about the psychology of that place I think that's difficult to do because each and every person is so different in every atheist has their own issues but what I find today is that so many people are flocking to atheism not so much a theism as they say it's atheism but it's not really an atheism it's more of an agnosticism and most of this agnosticism comes from being lazy we've stopped praying we've stopped going to church for years we haven't gone to church we've indulged in sin and once we start indulging in sin the Bible says that sin blinds you so you can't even see God anymore then you start questioning whether God exists if you happen to go to a science class and hear anything that sounds remotely scientific then you're like oh that makes sense now you don't look up your own faith at that aspect you don't look up your own questions of faith to see if that actually makes sense to you just take something without any question you say oh this is obviously true it's science where is that stuff that's just based on faith and it's stupid and then they need to prove that and I think a lot of people are very angry I think especially the angriest atheists are the ones who have been really hurt or there are the ones who don't want to follow the rules and need justification to justify their sin or their actions I get into a lot of discussions on homosexuality for example and with atheists and they say well the Catholic Church could and the Bible condemns cotton the book a little forget it I said that cotton is an abomination and I said okay great why does it condemn Kyne birds chirping silence they have they've never looked these up they're just looking for ways to do all they do and this is horrible intellectualism if you can even call it that but you only study one side and you say that that's truth it's like a cult they say it's true because they've never seen anything else but when you tell them many diseases contracted with cotton God banned that to save people's lives it actually makes a lot of sense and so you could look up everything in the Bible and find that it actually has reasons the problem with atheists is they have it they just look through it they say it's stupid and that name LaVon there's no intellectualism with it many times I have many many many books by atheists and by anti Catholics on my shelves read them I know the other side I've studied them and anytime I get into conversations with atheist I ask them how many books have you read from beginning to end written by a theist in other words what evidence have you actually studied understand and then rejected for a good reason and I've almost never found any atheists that have found or even studied this so that's why I say personally I find a lot of atheists to be emotional no nothin guy not all of them I mean certainly some of them are very intellectual and they have some good arguments but the atheists of old like Bertrand Russell who actually had a lot of really good arguments against God and against religion they were intellectuals nowadays you have hack jobs like Richard Dawkins and Hitchens who just are so angry that they just make fun of religion and their arguments are terrible and instead maybe they should get rid of half of their sass and replace that with some intellectual and theological accuracy and that maybe we could have a good deep discussion because I just find that most of the Asian atheists follow the New Atheism today Hitchens Harris Dennett Dawkins who are very sassy in anti religion and a lot of these people who are very emotional in our culture's today just kind of assume that emotional position as well and it becomes a passion without intellectual study does that make sense yeah it sure does sure makes a lot of sense yeah a really quick one for you here what are three things that I can do to make myself a better Catholic or to be more Catholic or to be more on fire for Jesus Christ three things I could do three things you can do is to pray for at least 30 minutes a day we need to have a good solid passionate prayer life because we can't know Jesus otherwise I mean we know of him and a lot of people in the church replace Jesus in a relationship with Jesus with apologetics or with knowledge or with doing things for him you can know all about a person without actually knowing a person and if we don't know Jesus that's not going to go well for us in the end no matter how much we know so I recommend praying for an half an hour and if you're really serious about your Catholic faith an hour every day but really just have a good prayer time with God it's necessary it's it's so important second I think you should study your faith you should learn it weekly read some good books or go to a good YouTube channel go to Catholic Answers or soon my channel Catholic truth but I think you really need to know your Catholic faith so the first one is prayer and spirituality you know confession going to church and not just going through the motions but really trying to make it deep the second one is learning your faith and then the third one is living your faith without compromise look at what you watch look at what you listen to look at what we read or these things approved by Christ if Jesus was sitting next to you would you watch Game of Thrones would you watch Family Guy South Park I mean would you listen to Ozzy Osbourne or ac/dc or metallic I mean there's a lot of things that we compromise on in our life and we need to take a look at our life and say what is really from God and what needs to go even if I like it the more things you get rid of in your life that displease God that we're compromising on like sin pornography or anything else like that the more room we're gonna make in our life for God for him to come and fill us to overflowing so a prayer and spiritual life knowing your faith and then living your faith those would be my suggestions nice try if you would please to name your top three favorite Saints without including Mary st. Francis DeSales because he's the patron saint of apologetics he was incredibly wholly unlike Luther who tried to reform the church and failed because he had a temper and he just was not holy and not the man to do it st. Francis DeSales helped reform the church because he was holy and he ended up converting over thirty sixty thousand Protestants back to the Catholic faith because of his evangelization and persistence another one of my favorite Saints is st. Raphael the Archangel mostly because I'm kind of a hopeless romantic and I love the love story and he kind of gave the devil the big boot in in the book of Tobit and he brought Sara and Tobiah together to be together for life so he's the patron saint of happy marriages he's the patron saint of chaste courtships patron saint of safe travelers of healing of a lot of the things that I can really relate to and then I would say my third favorite patron saint although I have a lot is probably Saint Francis of Assisi because it was my confirmation name and he was incredibly 100% on fire passionate for Jesus I mean everything was given to Jesus he was so passionate he went to the Muslims and asked them to martyr him and to kill him so he could die out of love for Jesus just as Jesus died of out of love for him and if you read the writings of Francis if you look at his life he's just so joyful he's just so passionate and fervent and I really loved that about him and I pray that I can be that in my own life Wow I think Chesterton wrote about him is that right I believe so yes yeah I always ask my guest at the end of the interview to close the show with a positive thought something nice for the listeners that they can take away and think about what do you think you might be able to say to anyone that's out there listening now I would say that number one the Catholic Church is the true divinely started Church of Jesus Christ the holy son of God and it's been here for 2,000 years and despite people trying to kill it and destroy it for centuries the Catholic Church still exists then even with problems from without and from within the Catholic Church still exists and here's my most positive thought is that right now in 2019 it's being renewed it's being renewed I mean here in the United States alone you can see men's groups starting all around the country you can see Catholic organizations like EWTN Catholic Answers and all these lay apostolates rising up I mean EWTN is the biggest religious organization in the world right now for TV and radio and all of that Franciscan University many years ago did you throughout the summer they had about 10,000 kids each summer and they had so many teens coming that they actually had to turn thousands and thousands away so they actually started that conference in four different states still had a turn thousands of kids away at each location so they started it in eight different states than twelve different states seventeen and now it's more than 21 states in the United States and in Canada and it's grows like wildfire I mean we have thousands and thousands of teens and thousands of vocations coming out of this and we also have spawn offs like camp Veritas which started with 50 kids a few years ago and as now has over 1,600 and five locations it's I mean we're really like the Holy Spirit is really starting to renew the church and we are going to be inspired and we're going to be blessed and the gates of Hell will never ever prevail against our church Christ is renewing us he's restoring us and it's going to be beautiful but we need to be part of that springtime of the New Evangelization we need to live our faith without compromise "